Ask the SEO Guru

Question for the Week of May 29th, 2008

I had a drive by comment on my last post today and I felt that it is a good enough question that it should be a topic and not just a reply. It is something that I feel doesn’t get discussed nearly enough in the seo community so this is my chance to do more than just complain about it.

This comment was made in reference to my last post about an interview I gave last week.  Interview is here Eric Enge @ Stone Temple

And the post is here Page Rank - where it's been and where it's going

Here’s the question:

Actually, the heart of watching the numbers is to ensure you hit your objectives, but the need to demonstrate ROI certainly SHOULD be the primary purpose, at least in most cases,  but is actually whatever the client tells you it is. Believe it or not, most clients come to a website promoter demanding, insisting on an expecting – placements. And  if a client comes to you telling you they want o be number 1 for anything, then it is usually difficult to attempt to educate them on looking for ROI without talking down to them and making them feel a little silly for not thinking of it themselves. 

It's sad but true. I usually simply do what they ask and try to develop the kind of relationship with them over time that enables me to be more forthcoming without offending or talking down to them. I also find it easier to establish that kind of relationship while they are paying me as opposed to paying one of my competitors.

As more and more people become more and more educated about the web and what it can do, that is changing slowly. Painfully slow. Even so, I still rarely equate numbers with ROI specifically and rather think of it as simply objectives.

So, whether it is ROI, tracking referrers, conversions or just wanting traffic levels to increase the perceived value of your online real estate, they are all objectives and indicators need to be watched if you expect to know when you are on the right track and when you’re done.

I always watch indicators and as for the term “important indicators”, that’s a subjective term. If you think they are important – you’re right.

You can find stats and analytic programs off the shelf to track, store, alert and suggest based on it’s own data for pretty much any metric you can dream up. I’ve run across a LOT of would be marketers who run so many stats and analytic programs that their life is little more than checking stats and running reports. I suggest you get the stats you want but only for the purpose of hitting your numbers. When you spend so much time tracking customers that you don’t have time to sell something, you lose!

So, step 1 is to decide what you want and why.

Let’s first look at just basic traffic and referrer tracking.

For simply tracking traffic levels and referrers,  there are LOTS of free stats stuff out there that will give you that. Awstats, and Webalizer are both free programs that come with just about any hosting account or server account. Then there is Extreme Tracking. One of the oldest free stats programs out there and does fine for basics if you don’t mind displaying a goofy little button on your site that anyone can click and view your stats without a password, (not recommended for anyone serious about making a few bucks online). There are ways around it but it’s against their TOS and I believe if you’re gonna play, play fair.

Doing a search for free stats programs will give you plenty of options to slog through but I have had experience with each of the ones I mentioned and they are easy and simple and do an acceptable job for the basic stuff.

Now let’s talk about the ROI tracking.

I know this topic gets thrown around a lot in SEM circles and virtually every post regardless of quality or credibility gets that knowing nod from the members with little challenge. I too am guilty of letting broad and often nonsensical, ”ROI is everything” statements stand without speaking out, but now we’re in MY house and I can say what I want without the flames, so ------

The Reality is You Can NOT Prove or Demonstrate ROI to a Client.

At least not unless you have control over or intimate knowledge of, cost of goods, pricing, inventory levels, floor planning, interest rates, taxes, shipping costs, hiring and salaries, bonuses and commissions, returns, missed deadlines, customer service efficiency, and a few other details  but I’m going to assume you get the point.

Any one of those things could have as much an impact on ROI as how many hits you get to a webpage or any kind of hits to orders ratio. You can demonstrate how he paid you $10,000 and within 180 days you generated $100,000 in orders BUT, orders aren’t profits and that $10,000 was likely a fraction of the investment he expects a return on.

Sure, you can show a client that you had a 40% conversion rate and prove that you had 100 hits and 40 orders but if the CEO is spending all his money shooting up pot and snorting blondes, he’s going to go broke and you lose a client. Period.

Few clients are going to give you control or knowledge of those other types of metrics or tell you how much pot they’re shootin up.

There certainly are people out there hiring SEO’s who damn sure do know how to determine ROI, just as sure as there are a lot of people hiring SEOs who don’t but both types of clients are still businessmen and they still have their own ideas of what they need to do to determine their own ROI .

So my point is simply that I believe the smart thing to do is let the client tell you what metrics they expect you to give them and then find the program or system to monitor and report the metrics that give the client what he expects. To me, that enables you to control your own income objectives and ROI.

That said, if you can’t generate revenue through your efforts, then eventually you will lose the client. If you can generate sales as a direct result of your work, then even if the CEO is sharing his money with three ex-wives and an IRS agent, he is still more likely to continue with you because a bad business with sales is still much better than a bad business with no sales. Odds are very good he will still eventually go broke but there can be no question that the more sales, the longer even a bad business can survive.

Keep in mind that for the last year my focus has shifted dramatically from providing SEO for individuals to wholesale link building and content generation for other SEO companies, so I don’t have the time to focus on analytics, (occasionally someone makes it worth my time), like I used to. Plus, for the last 6 or 7 years I’ve mostly used my own custom program for tracking and analytics but when I did use commercial stuff regularly, here is what I used and what I learned about important indicators early in the game.

Again, step 1 is to determine the objective and what data you need to track the numbers to make sure all your indicators are pointing north.

Most important in my opinion is software that does more than just collect referrers, IP’s, words from search engines, etc. What you really want to know is where a hit came from on a page, how long the hit stayed and which link they clicked to leave the page.

What you’re looking for is a hit getting to a page and what referrer they came from. If it was a search engine, what keyword/phrase did they use to find that page? If it was another webpage, (especially forums/blogs/social sites), what was said to make the link relevant enough to get the user to your page? Finally, how long they stayed on the page until they clicked a link or the back button?

So know you know someone came to the page and why. Does the content they get when they get there relate to the content that made them come in the first place?  Always remember that once you hit a page, there are only 3 ways for them to leave.

NOTE: there are some pretty tricky browser scripts out there that offer options, but that stuff is beyond the scope of this discussion.

#1. Close the browser. This happens VERY rarely. So rarely in fact, I don’t feel it worth discussing  in this post.

#2. Click a link that takes them somewhere else. (remember, YOU control these)

#3. Hit the back button. By far the most common exit from a page.

#2 and #3 are the ones we are interested in now.

You can’t track a back button hit, (I wasted a lot of time and money trying to develop something that would--- and failed.), but you can track that they didn’t hit anything else. There may be something available now that I’m not aware of because like I said, I’ve been using custom software of my own for a long time now.

If you could track the back button, you could estimate how much time the average person spent on the page before leaving. That way you could fairly accurately calculate how much the visitor for which referrer read before they left. Then just keep altering the text until they start clicking the links you want them to click instead of the back button. Because by far the biggest reason people hit the back button is because they don’t “feel” like they got what they were expecting when they first clicked a link somewhere to get to this page.

The Back Button Boogie

Even though I was never able to figure out how to track the back button hits and how fast, I’ve been doing this kind of work a long time, I’ve worked with a LOT of people and software and I’ve asked a LOT of people a LOT of questions. From all of that experience, (experience is what you get when you’re expecting something else.), I’m able to make an educated guess with a high degree of confidence. You have about 3 to 5 seconds to convince a visitor that they found the page they were looking for when they hit that last link to get to this page. If you don’t convince them, they do the back button boogie and they’re gone.

So, if I can’t track the back button but I CAN track any other link they click on the page, I watch the referrers closely and make sure that the majority that get to a specific page all came from closely related terms. If I see I’m getting hits to one page for shoes and tennis rackets, I know I’ve screwed it up and start looking for ways to separate the two options and get shoe people to shoe content and tennis people to tennis content. Even if it’s not feasible, (did I mention I have custom software?), then I choose the highest number of related referrers and talk to them and just accept I’m getting the back button boogie for almost all the others.

Once I am confident that I’m getting targeted visitors, then I structure the content so that I’m basically saying in 5 seconds or less, HEY, YOU SMART PERSON OF THE WEB PERSUASION, YOU FOUND THE EXACT RIGHT PAGE AND HERE IS THE HUGE BENEFIT YOU GET AS A REWARD. Then offer them a series of navigational links to lead them into a conversion process and to be able to gather data on what these people looking for this thing has responded to.

Usually the links I offer are the basics. Click here for pricing, click here for specs, click here for discount coupons, etc.

Now when I get 100 people to the page and 40 of them click one of the 3 or 4 links I offer, I know two things.

#1. 60% of the people did the back button boogie

#2. I said the exact right thing to get 40% to move them towards a buying decision

Now, just keep repeating the process until you get the order. If they click informational links, then give them information in a feature/ benefit/ call to action format and then offer them  another 2-4 link options based on the referrer, (what they just clicked on from your own previous page).

At each step, keep looking for that 40% number. I suggest 40% because over the years that has consistently worked out to be about a 5-10% conversion ratio from all the hits to the domain. I always shoot for 100% on each page and I always look for ways to get closer to that 100% but there comes a point of diminishing returns and you find your time better spent elsewhere.

There is a LOT more we could go into. Analytics is certainly an art that those who master it profit well from but the basics I’ve outlined here are the kind of stuff that anyone can do. I’m sure of that because if I can do it -- ANYONE can do it and doing it takes your skill set, and revenue potential, to a whole other level beyond search engine placement and traffic generation.

I’ll be honest, I rarely do this level of work for individual clients any longer because it is very labor intensive and few clients understand it well enough to justify the fees I have to charge to be able to do it. But I certainly do it for my own stuff. At least my stuff I care enough about. I should be doing more of it and so should you.

Below are some stats programs I’ve used over the years. I don’t recommend one over the other because to me, it is mostly a matter of preference. They all do a lot and do it pretty well but they each left me with the motivation to build my own.

Web Trends     Omniture      Netiq  

I urge you to consider these carefully before making a financial commitment. Good analytics can get expensive and you need to be sure that the program you choose will do the job you want it to do.

The next ones are free but sometimes free costs far more than simply paying for what you need.

google analytics, (formerly Urchin)  

awstats  

webalizer

extreme tracker

I already gave you links to these sites above. Jeesh! You're too lazy to scroll up?? You really are an SEO huh?

Peace Y’all

G

Course you broke your little sister’s bike. You knew damn well you were too big to be ridin that thang! Now just wait till your father gets home boy. He’s gonna let you have it.

I was honored this past week when I was asked for an interview by Eric Enge www.stonetemple.com/blog/.

 I did my best to try add value to Eric’s site and good name as a token of my appreciation and I certainly wouldn’t want to do anything to steal his thunder. However I realize that his readers aren’t necessarily my readers and there was one question in particular that I wanted to make sure and share with my readers.

So I hope I’m not breaking any kind of secret blogger’s code of etiquette by posting one out of the 10 questions I answered for Eric. If I am I do apologize.

Question for the Week of May 20th, 2008

 You have been doing online traffic development and link building for a long time guru.  How has this evolved over the years? 

Yes, I have been doing it a long time and I’m grateful.

I don't see traffic generation as having evolved that much since I first started focusing on driving customers to my stores in the 70's. Of course technology has offered alternative means to an end, but traffic generation then and now has always been about:

Getting an idea for, or finding a need or desire for, a product or service.

Doing the research to determine market size, demand, cost, revenue potential and competition.

Setting an objective and developing a strategy based on competitive analysis, SWOTs, (strengths, weaknesses, opportunity and threats), and available capital.

Execute the strategy and watch the numbers.

Link building is a horse of a different color.   

     Back in the late part of the 20^th century, links were strictly, only, exclusively for directing traffic to places you thought your visitors would think was cool. Everybody linked out all the time with no ulterior motive other than helping people find stuff the webmaster thought was cool. Of course one reason people linked out so freely is because search engines pretty much sucked and was a long way from being scalable. Links were the dominate web and not search engines.

That's not to say there was no link spam. Anyone else old enough to remember guest books? I can even remember a time when a basic website offering had to include a questbook script as the 5 or 6 prerequisite pages.

As those started going up, here came the viagra ads. Oh wait, there was no such thing as viagra back then. Men with ED were left to rely on the miracles of penis pumps and attaching bungee cords with weights on one end to their minuscule members. So I've heard.

But the point is, there was no shortage of guestbook posts telling visitors about urls for home loans, backup software, web hosting, etc, etc, etc. Your garden variety pre-viagra, pre-page rank link spam.

Even so, these drive-by fruitings still had only to do with stealing direct traffic and had nothing to do with trying to influence any search engine.

Those type of links, (or any other links for that matter), had no effect on search engines because no search engine at the time was using anything other than on-site algorithms to determine relevancy and placement. It was wonderful in a never going to cut it kind of way.

With all the majors at the time, Infoseek, Excite, Alta Vista, Lycos, Hot Bot, Web Crawler, and the like, it took little more than 45 minutes and a meta refresh tag to secure top 10 placements. A blind, deaf monkey with one arm could do it. Did I mention it was wonderful?

Well, we all knew this couldn't last forever. Especially the search engines and me.

Then in the early days of the 21st century, (after we all realized that the world would not end due to Y2K), I began noticing some strange things happening with the top search engine du jour, Alta Vista. Contrary to popular misconception, Google was not the first to incorporate links into the algorithm, they were just much better at setting up hardware to handle load balancing, (and of course public relations), than CMGI http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AltaVista.

But it was obvious that everyone had accepted on site optimization alone was not an indication of quality or relevance controllable with automated programs and that inbound links was going to be the next step in the search for a scalable solution.

Then came Google and the toolbar and their exceptional promotional skills. All of a sudden direct traffic became a secondary consideration behind Google SERP placement. Then came the SearchKing vs Google thing and the paid link industry was born. The following day Google's war on the paid links industry was born.

Then we went through the "a PR 7 beat a PR 6". That ship has sailed.

Then we went through the "if 1 link is good, then 3 million must be better, blog, comment spamming" era. That ship is still visible on the horizon, but it is fading fast. Good riddance!

Then we come to "trust rank". PR is just about as useful as a third handlebar on a Harley nowadays and a link that makes sense, sitting on a pr 1 will move a target site faster than a PR 7 page as a list of 300 "resources" < extreme sarcastic tone implied by italics<

Now we are seeing a new wind beginning to blow and I believe it will be the next step in the evolution of the search for the perfect algorithm. Personalization.

I believe we are seeing the acceptance, (not the same thing as admission), of the fact that using links to determine relevance and placement is better than on site alone but it is far from flaw free. Bottom line, it doesn't work.

Now I believe the future is in tracking who you are, what you think and how you act in response to online experiences to determine trust in YOU in regards to a specific topic or even query is going to replace PR as the determining factor for who goes on top for what search query.

Personality management I believe is going to start getting big fast. If you ever get the chance, speak to John Andrews, http://www.johnon.com and Fantomaster, http://www.fantomaster.com about this topic. They'll REALLY spin your gears.

This shift in search engines accepting the limitations of page rank, coupled with blended, personalized results, will have a huge impact on the evolution of not only SEO but of online marketing in general over the next 5 years or so.

But I could be wrong.

Peace Y’all

G

If you don’t quit pickin at that thang it’s NEVER gonna heal!

Question for the Week of May 12th, 2008

Yesterday I had a question from a client asking how many keywords we will target for each project. It reminded me that out of all the questions I get that illustrate a need for better understanding of how an SEO process works, this is one of the top 5.

I think of all the things I could discuss to the benefit of my readers, answering this question will do the most good for the most people with the least words spent. So, here is the question and my response in italics.

*************************************

We would like to target at least 25 keywords for each client.  When I first spoke with you Guru, this is how I understood it and that is how we were doing it with our previous SEO company.

How many keywords can you target for each client?

It looks like I didn't do a very good job of explaining the whole, "target keywords" thing. I'll take another stab at it today to help you understand the process.

#1. We can target 25 keywords, 250 or 25,000. BUT you can't target them all at once. For best results, we should stay on theme with a small number of specific long tail terms. In other words, we can target keywords under the umbrella of say jewelry, AND necklaces AND rings, but  it is best to stay focused on one of them and expand them over time. By targeting necklaces and rings, in a way you are reducing the relevancy for one by trying to promote the other.  It is better to have solid content for the target and then try to get anchor text at about a 60/40 split to the specific content url and to the index page. This shows the engines that we are relevant to necklaces OR rings. Then we just repeat the process as we add relevant content for target terms or THEMES.

#2. We can’t choose the keywords or the time to promote them. You are in much more control over the content than we are and you just need to let us know which keywords you want when and we'll do it. To us it doesn't matter if you give us 2 targets or 200, you just need to let us know where the content is and what keywords you want to target. We can do the research for you but it is your decision. We can’t decide for you and then tell you what we want to target, we need to target what you tell us you want and when.

#3. Search engine placement is about 4 primary things. Of course there are a lot of small things you can do involving Htags, meta tags , etc, but these 4 things,(listed in order of importance), are what moves placements upwards.
Technical issues. making sure you are getting crawled and indexed properly
Relevant content. Content that is focused and provides value associated with a target term of phrase.
Relevant links. Links that show the engines that other people feel your content is relevant to a specific theme.
Trust. Doing things with the promotion of your site that makes the engines trust your content and links and NOT doing things to make them not trust you.

Any one of those things will not move a page to the top 10 for a search query without the other 3 in place, (content is kind of an exception. You actually can move a site with content alone IF the technical issues are in place, you have at least one spiderable link and there is a lack of solid relevant content  competeing for the exact term) By the same token, three of the four things in place and it will not work. The optimum solution is the right combination of all 4.

#4. Targeting keywords should not be the primary objective. Top 10 placements mean beating out at least 1 of the 10 links that are already in the top 10. It takes a lot of work, resources and focus. That stuff is not cheap so there is a definite expense associated with gaining top 10 positions. What we want is conversions. Sales! Sales is revenue and targeting keywords is an expense.

So targeting keywords should be more of a surgical maneuver than a shotgun approach. We should set an objective for what we want to SELL, then develop the appropriate content and then promote that content while maintaining the integrity of the site. That is what works, and that is what keeps your clients paying for your services.

Build the converting content based on your clients stated objective, (we can build the content for you if you need us to), tell us about the content and where to find it, we'll perform the research to provide a solid list of target terms and we'll take it from there once you approve.

It's not about how many keywords to target. We'll target UNLIMTED keywords for you. It is about setting a sales, (or desired action), objective and then using us to help you hit it.

Remember, that was in response to a question from an existing client. There is nothing that we do that you can’t do for yourself and the concepts are the same. This was an illustration to make the concept more obvious.

The point is to keep in mind the next time an SEO company is pitching you their service and they tell you they will target x number of keywords, remember targeting keywords doesn’t make you money. SALES makes you money and the only keywords you need to target are the ones that make sales, (or achieve a desired action).

If 1 keyword makes you money, then 2 is better BUT, as soon as you start devoting assets to keywords that DON’T make you money, and you just want the placement for the sake of the placement, you’re wasting your time, your money and the time of everyone that sees your placement where they searched.

Peace Y’all

G

I’m back in the land of the free and the home of the brave. And I’m already missing Samosas and Chana Puri.

It is a very strange thing living on two continents. After spending 7 months of the last 10 in India, and the fact that is where my business is now, my head seems a bit confused as to where home is and where I’m visiting.  Oddly enough, I feel as out-of-place in Oklahoma City now as I felt my first month in Ahmedabad.

It doesn’t help that our business there is growing very fast and the excitement is taking hold and I want to be there to enjoy it. It also doesn’t help that I have now become addicted to chana puri and finding Punjabi food in Oklahoma is about as easy as finding a street address in India. 

I’ll be in the states for two months until about July 1^st, then I’ll make that grueling 30+hour  trip back to Ahemdabad and stay until the 1^st of November.

My focus this last trip was to build a stronger marketing team and solidify our seo procedures. I’m very pleased with the results of my endeavors!

My primary marketing target was to secure wholesale SEO companies that we can provide link building and original content for. We’ve done well.

We are now working with some of the best known SEO firms in the world and are providing links and content for some 200 domains a month. With a staff of 18, we are generating over 4,000 researched, manually secured and ON THEME links each week. We are growing fast because we treat our clients business like it was ours, because in a way, it is. We need you more than you need us and we understand that because I’m an SEO too. I’ve been there and I KNOW  the challenges you face and that  is why our commitment to excellence is second to none.

I’ve put together a team in India that specializes in doing the tasks that are so important to any SEO campaign yet are the most labor intensive parts. We specialize in ultra white hat, strictly manual link building  and high quality, original content creation for wholesale  SEO clients. The two parts of SEO that everyone needs and very few enjoy doing. We do the hard work you don't like doing and that frees up your time to do the things you are best at and do enjoy doing!

My goal is nothing short of changing the world’s perception that Indian outsourcing is only about cheap labor and poor quality.  I’ve put a LOT of work and money into this but I could not be more proud of the results we’re getting!

It’s all good and it is without a doubt the adventure of a lifetime.

Peace Y’all

I’m gonna take a switch to your butt if you don’t quit chasin your sister with that bug damnit!